<?xml version="1.0" encoding="utf-8"?><rss version="2.0"
	xmlns:content="http://purl.org/rss/1.0/modules/content/"
	xmlns:dc="http://purl.org/dc/elements/1.1/"
	xmlns:atom="http://www.w3.org/2005/Atom"
	xmlns:sy="http://purl.org/rss/1.0/modules/syndication/"
		>
<channel>
	<title>Comments on: Sing Softly</title>
	<atom:link href="http://www.tinmanic.com/archives/2005/02/20/sing-softly/feed/" rel="self" type="application/rss+xml" />
	<link>http://www.tinmanic.com/archives/2005/02/20/sing-softly/</link>
	<description></description>
	<lastBuildDate>Wed, 08 Feb 2012 17:46:42 +0000</lastBuildDate>
	<sy:updatePeriod>hourly</sy:updatePeriod>
	<sy:updateFrequency>1</sy:updateFrequency>
	<generator>http://wordpress.org/?v=3.3</generator>
	<item>
		<title>By: Ray</title>
		<link>http://www.tinmanic.com/archives/2005/02/20/sing-softly/comment-page-1/#comment-3307</link>
		<dc:creator>Ray</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 28 Feb 2005 16:30:35 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.tinmanic.com/archives/2005/02/20/sing-softly/#comment-3307</guid>
		<description>After reading Jeff&#039;s blog, I was a little upset so I decided to write a comment just to vent out my anger. I do not know what I would have done at a similar circumstance because I am not a confrontational type, maybe I would have walked out since I was just there to volunteer my time. 
First of all I am there to represent a gay organization such as the chorus and to blatantly be told that they would not recognize me for who I am? because of women who have different religious beliefs, that is just plainly wrong. And for knowing that it is wrong to discriminate and not do anything about it, that just angers me.We should not tolerate the intolerance!</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>After reading Jeff&#8217;s blog, I was a little upset so I decided to write a comment just to vent out my anger. I do not know what I would have done at a similar circumstance because I am not a confrontational type, maybe I would have walked out since I was just there to volunteer my time.<br />
First of all I am there to represent a gay organization such as the chorus and to blatantly be told that they would not recognize me for who I am? because of women who have different religious beliefs, that is just plainly wrong. And for knowing that it is wrong to discriminate and not do anything about it, that just angers me.We should not tolerate the intolerance!</p>
]]></content:encoded>
	</item>
	<item>
		<title>By: vlad</title>
		<link>http://www.tinmanic.com/archives/2005/02/20/sing-softly/comment-page-1/#comment-3303</link>
		<dc:creator>vlad</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Fri, 25 Feb 2005 16:19:14 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.tinmanic.com/archives/2005/02/20/sing-softly/#comment-3303</guid>
		<description>I also sing with the GGC in New York, and I participated in a similar event at Carnegie Hall 2 years ago doing exactly the same piece. The GGC was a part of a bigger group of singers which primarily consisted of choral groups from the &#039;red&#039; states and various christian organizations. 

We were announced as the Gay Gotham Chorus to other singers, and you could see that some of them were visibly shaken by that fact, and they did not seem to be to comfortable with the idea that they would have to be around so many homos for 3 days in a row. However, there were no signs of disrespect towards any of us, and after 3 days of rehearsals various singing groups became more integrated, and we actually developed friendly relations with all of them, including those people who probably originally thought that we should burn in hell.

In my opinion, a lot of problems with the recognition of gay issues in the US are partly due to radicalization of gay movement - everything has to be a fight, a struggle, a molotoff cocktail party, and it is us against them. It was true back in 1969, but I would hope that social progress moves forward, and that the &#039;fight&#039; theme should have become a collaboraton and negotiation theme. 

To cut the long story short, I don&#039;t think there would have been too much trouble if your conductor &#039;outed&#039; you to the christians. It would have been a good thing as it could create an opportunity to establish a dialogue with those people, and change their perception of us as plain perverts. Isolating ourselves from the rest of the mankind is not going to help to address homophobia, etc. The cause of homophobia is lack of interaction between gays and heterosexuals in a day-to-day environment. Too bad your Baptist women did not know you were gay - you could have made the world a better place!</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I also sing with the GGC in New York, and I participated in a similar event at Carnegie Hall 2 years ago doing exactly the same piece. The GGC was a part of a bigger group of singers which primarily consisted of choral groups from the &#8216;red&#8217; states and various christian organizations. </p>
<p>We were announced as the Gay Gotham Chorus to other singers, and you could see that some of them were visibly shaken by that fact, and they did not seem to be to comfortable with the idea that they would have to be around so many homos for 3 days in a row. However, there were no signs of disrespect towards any of us, and after 3 days of rehearsals various singing groups became more integrated, and we actually developed friendly relations with all of them, including those people who probably originally thought that we should burn in hell.</p>
<p>In my opinion, a lot of problems with the recognition of gay issues in the US are partly due to radicalization of gay movement &#8211; everything has to be a fight, a struggle, a molotoff cocktail party, and it is us against them. It was true back in 1969, but I would hope that social progress moves forward, and that the &#8216;fight&#8217; theme should have become a collaboraton and negotiation theme. </p>
<p>To cut the long story short, I don&#8217;t think there would have been too much trouble if your conductor &#8216;outed&#8217; you to the christians. It would have been a good thing as it could create an opportunity to establish a dialogue with those people, and change their perception of us as plain perverts. Isolating ourselves from the rest of the mankind is not going to help to address homophobia, etc. The cause of homophobia is lack of interaction between gays and heterosexuals in a day-to-day environment. Too bad your Baptist women did not know you were gay &#8211; you could have made the world a better place!</p>
]]></content:encoded>
	</item>
	<item>
		<title>By: Chris</title>
		<link>http://www.tinmanic.com/archives/2005/02/20/sing-softly/comment-page-1/#comment-3293</link>
		<dc:creator>Chris</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 24 Feb 2005 12:21:14 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.tinmanic.com/archives/2005/02/20/sing-softly/#comment-3293</guid>
		<description>It is not fair to chastise the Tin Man for what he did or didn’t do.

The oddest thing about this “incident” is why skittish (if not homophobic) professional concert organizers invited the adult Gay Gotham Chorus in the first place.  According to the company&#039;s website, the concert had two college and seven high school choruses.  While three were from the South, one was from New York, two from New Jersey, and three from Minnesota.  In red and blue states, officials are wary of any controversy that could potentially offend parents.  As he stated, it’s unlikely any of the choruses knew the “Gotham Chorus” men are gay. 

Another factor which may have influenced the organizers’ actions was that part of the concert was a Black History Month tribute with American spiritual songs.  It is possible they were concerned about the sexual sensibilities of blacks and Christians.  

It is unfair to compare the Tin Man to Rosa Parks.  What happened to him at Carnegie Hall has nothing in common with what occurred in Montgomery.  Rosa Parks was a &lt;a href=”http://www.hfmgv.org/exhibits/rosaparks/chronoprint.asp”&gt;civil rights activist&lt;/a&gt;, who had previously been removed from other buses for refusing to give up her seat.  She knew civil rights leaders had planned a bus boycott and were waiting for the right time to start it.  Ms. Parks did not act spontaneously &lt;a href=”http://www.spokaneschools.org/Equity/Tools/RosaParks.pdf”&gt;that day&lt;/a&gt;.  She was not sitting in the front of the bus; she was in the first row of the “colored section,” which was still in the back of the bus.  

The Tin Man was center stage at Carnegie Hall.  With no forewarnings, he was thrust into a last minute situation, which necessitated an instantaneous reaction with no confirmable community support.   While it is easy to look at what happened in our omnipotent retrospectoscopes, it is always hard when we have to spontaneously act.  The Tin Man did not deny his sexuality or fail to do his part in advancing gay rights.  He did what he went to Carnegie Hall to do:  sing.

It is interesting the Tin Man was singled out by his old glee club conductor.  Perhaps he was the designated group leader, but it seems as if it was his mentor’s way of apologizing for the decision of the organization, while saying he accepts the Tin Man for who he is. The conductor could have easily announced the altered name to the audience without telling the Tin Man or the GGC and if questioned later attributed it to a slip of the tongue.  Unlike the other choruses, it doesn’t seem they were on the written program.

While it’s unlikely concert-goers googled the “Gotham Chorus” after the performance to learn more about them, if they do, they would easily discover the group’s &lt;a href=”http://www.google.com/search?hl=en&amp;ie=ISO-8859-1&amp;q=%22gotham+chorus%22”&gt; complete name&lt;/a&gt;.

Regrettably, it seems the two GREATEST things that happened may be getting overlooked.  The Tin Man let a man who he admires know him more fully by coming out to him.  (Bravo!)  And, he and his boyfriend sang at Carnegie Hall.  Carnegie Hall!!!  That is sooo freakin’ fantastic!  It’s every musician’s dream come true.  Well, perhaps not everyone’s, but what Jeff and Matt did was to achieve something truly AWESOME !   (Color me green.)</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>It is not fair to chastise the Tin Man for what he did or didn’t do.</p>
<p>The oddest thing about this “incident” is why skittish (if not homophobic) professional concert organizers invited the adult Gay Gotham Chorus in the first place.  According to the company&#8217;s website, the concert had two college and seven high school choruses.  While three were from the South, one was from New York, two from New Jersey, and three from Minnesota.  In red and blue states, officials are wary of any controversy that could potentially offend parents.  As he stated, it’s unlikely any of the choruses knew the “Gotham Chorus” men are gay. </p>
<p>Another factor which may have influenced the organizers’ actions was that part of the concert was a Black History Month tribute with American spiritual songs.  It is possible they were concerned about the sexual sensibilities of blacks and Christians.  </p>
<p>It is unfair to compare the Tin Man to Rosa Parks.  What happened to him at Carnegie Hall has nothing in common with what occurred in Montgomery.  Rosa Parks was a <a href=”http://www.hfmgv.org/exhibits/rosaparks/chronoprint.asp”>civil rights activist</a>, who had previously been removed from other buses for refusing to give up her seat.  She knew civil rights leaders had planned a bus boycott and were waiting for the right time to start it.  Ms. Parks did not act spontaneously <a href=”http://www.spokaneschools.org/Equity/Tools/RosaParks.pdf”>that day</a>.  She was not sitting in the front of the bus; she was in the first row of the “colored section,” which was still in the back of the bus.  </p>
<p>The Tin Man was center stage at Carnegie Hall.  With no forewarnings, he was thrust into a last minute situation, which necessitated an instantaneous reaction with no confirmable community support.   While it is easy to look at what happened in our omnipotent retrospectoscopes, it is always hard when we have to spontaneously act.  The Tin Man did not deny his sexuality or fail to do his part in advancing gay rights.  He did what he went to Carnegie Hall to do:  sing.</p>
<p>It is interesting the Tin Man was singled out by his old glee club conductor.  Perhaps he was the designated group leader, but it seems as if it was his mentor’s way of apologizing for the decision of the organization, while saying he accepts the Tin Man for who he is. The conductor could have easily announced the altered name to the audience without telling the Tin Man or the GGC and if questioned later attributed it to a slip of the tongue.  Unlike the other choruses, it doesn’t seem they were on the written program.</p>
<p>While it’s unlikely concert-goers googled the “Gotham Chorus” after the performance to learn more about them, if they do, they would easily discover the group’s <a href=”http://www.google.com/search?hl=en&#038;ie=ISO-8859-1&#038;q=%22gotham+chorus%22”> complete name</a>.</p>
<p>Regrettably, it seems the two GREATEST things that happened may be getting overlooked.  The Tin Man let a man who he admires know him more fully by coming out to him.  (Bravo!)  And, he and his boyfriend sang at Carnegie Hall.  Carnegie Hall!!!  That is sooo freakin’ fantastic!  It’s every musician’s dream come true.  Well, perhaps not everyone’s, but what Jeff and Matt did was to achieve something truly AWESOME !   (Color me green.)</p>
]]></content:encoded>
	</item>
	<item>
		<title>By: Bart</title>
		<link>http://www.tinmanic.com/archives/2005/02/20/sing-softly/comment-page-1/#comment-3292</link>
		<dc:creator>Bart</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 24 Feb 2005 01:41:44 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.tinmanic.com/archives/2005/02/20/sing-softly/#comment-3292</guid>
		<description>I think it makes a difference if your organisation&#039;s name is &quot;Gay Gotham Chorus&quot; or not. If it is, it seems rediculous that you would have to change the name for a performace just to make someone else feel comfortable. Personally I would feel uncomfortable with hearing my organisation&#039;s name mispronounced on purpose and even moreso for this purpose.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I think it makes a difference if your organisation&#8217;s name is &#8220;Gay Gotham Chorus&#8221; or not. If it is, it seems rediculous that you would have to change the name for a performace just to make someone else feel comfortable. Personally I would feel uncomfortable with hearing my organisation&#8217;s name mispronounced on purpose and even moreso for this purpose.</p>
]]></content:encoded>
	</item>
	<item>
		<title>By: Tin Man</title>
		<link>http://www.tinmanic.com/archives/2005/02/20/sing-softly/comment-page-1/#comment-3290</link>
		<dc:creator>Tin Man</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 23 Feb 2005 15:51:46 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.tinmanic.com/archives/2005/02/20/sing-softly/#comment-3290</guid>
		<description>Tim, sorry the trackback didn&#039;t work...

And for the record, I&#039;d like everyone to know that my college glee club conductor was also Tim&#039;s college glee club conductor. :)</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Tim, sorry the trackback didn&#8217;t work&#8230;</p>
<p>And for the record, I&#8217;d like everyone to know that my college glee club conductor was also Tim&#8217;s college glee club conductor. :)</p>
]]></content:encoded>
	</item>
	<item>
		<title>By: Tim Jarrett</title>
		<link>http://www.tinmanic.com/archives/2005/02/20/sing-softly/comment-page-1/#comment-3289</link>
		<dc:creator>Tim Jarrett</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 23 Feb 2005 15:42:47 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.tinmanic.com/archives/2005/02/20/sing-softly/#comment-3289</guid>
		<description>I posted about this yesterday but the trackback didn&#039;t seem to take. I don&#039;t think this speaks very well about the courage of the concert manager:
http://discuss.jarretthousenorth.com/2005/02/22#a4785</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I posted about this yesterday but the trackback didn&#8217;t seem to take. I don&#8217;t think this speaks very well about the courage of the concert manager:<br />
<a href="http://discuss.jarretthousenorth.com/2005/02/22#a4785" rel="nofollow">http://discuss.jarretthousenorth.com/2005/02/22#a4785</a></p>
]]></content:encoded>
	</item>
	<item>
		<title>By: rob adams</title>
		<link>http://www.tinmanic.com/archives/2005/02/20/sing-softly/comment-page-1/#comment-3288</link>
		<dc:creator>rob adams</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 22 Feb 2005 18:16:50 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.tinmanic.com/archives/2005/02/20/sing-softly/#comment-3288</guid>
		<description>Yeah, it&#039;s such a minor thing.

Rosa should&#039;ve just gone with the flow, saved herself all the drama, and realized a seat in the back-vs-front is, in the big scheme of social-progress, minor and fairly silly -- and certainly not worth all the hassle.  It&#039;s best to be sensible than sensational.

Go ahead...  you just sit your gay behind in the back of the bus.

Not me.

rob@egoz.org</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Yeah, it&#8217;s such a minor thing.</p>
<p>Rosa should&#8217;ve just gone with the flow, saved herself all the drama, and realized a seat in the back-vs-front is, in the big scheme of social-progress, minor and fairly silly &#8212; and certainly not worth all the hassle.  It&#8217;s best to be sensible than sensational.</p>
<p>Go ahead&#8230;  you just sit your gay behind in the back of the bus.</p>
<p>Not me.</p>
<p><a href="mailto:rob@egoz.org">rob@egoz.org</a></p>
]]></content:encoded>
	</item>
	<item>
		<title>By: Matt (Jeff's Boyfriend)</title>
		<link>http://www.tinmanic.com/archives/2005/02/20/sing-softly/comment-page-1/#comment-3287</link>
		<dc:creator>Matt (Jeff's Boyfriend)</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 22 Feb 2005 17:35:59 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.tinmanic.com/archives/2005/02/20/sing-softly/#comment-3287</guid>
		<description>Let me just say that after spending 8 hours in rehearsal with these brats, I have no problem with the omission of the full name of our chorus (which would have outed us).  It just wouldn&#039;t be worth the drama or headache.  We haven&#039;t wanted much to interact with them and are looking forward to getting this stupid concert over and done with.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Let me just say that after spending 8 hours in rehearsal with these brats, I have no problem with the omission of the full name of our chorus (which would have outed us).  It just wouldn&#8217;t be worth the drama or headache.  We haven&#8217;t wanted much to interact with them and are looking forward to getting this stupid concert over and done with.</p>
]]></content:encoded>
	</item>
	<item>
		<title>By: Brian</title>
		<link>http://www.tinmanic.com/archives/2005/02/20/sing-softly/comment-page-1/#comment-3283</link>
		<dc:creator>Brian</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 22 Feb 2005 03:14:15 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.tinmanic.com/archives/2005/02/20/sing-softly/#comment-3283</guid>
		<description>Well, don&#039;t beat yourself up about it.  We all make choices about when it&#039;s important to come out.

That said, I think Tuesday night when the concert is over, it would be a fine time to kiss Matt in celebration.  Say, right there in front of some Baptists.  They probably won&#039;t even care, and they&#039;ll have a fabulous story to tell when they get home.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Well, don&#8217;t beat yourself up about it.  We all make choices about when it&#8217;s important to come out.</p>
<p>That said, I think Tuesday night when the concert is over, it would be a fine time to kiss Matt in celebration.  Say, right there in front of some Baptists.  They probably won&#8217;t even care, and they&#8217;ll have a fabulous story to tell when they get home.</p>
]]></content:encoded>
	</item>
	<item>
		<title>By: Mipiel</title>
		<link>http://www.tinmanic.com/archives/2005/02/20/sing-softly/comment-page-1/#comment-3282</link>
		<dc:creator>Mipiel</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 22 Feb 2005 02:30:34 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://www.tinmanic.com/archives/2005/02/20/sing-softly/#comment-3282</guid>
		<description>Potential Simple Solution: Now that you agreed to compromise your identity to protect the precious innocence of some Baptist girls, just go ahead and give the best performance that you can. Then, after the concert, casually walk hand in hand with Matt until the Baptists can see, and then give each other a big hug and kiss. Then walk away as if nothing happened. If they&#039;re unable to accept that gay men (and lesbians) are ordinary people just like them who do ordinary things like singing Beethoven that&#039;s their problem, not yours.

And best of luck (or &quot;broken legs&quot; as appropriate) with the performance.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Potential Simple Solution: Now that you agreed to compromise your identity to protect the precious innocence of some Baptist girls, just go ahead and give the best performance that you can. Then, after the concert, casually walk hand in hand with Matt until the Baptists can see, and then give each other a big hug and kiss. Then walk away as if nothing happened. If they&#8217;re unable to accept that gay men (and lesbians) are ordinary people just like them who do ordinary things like singing Beethoven that&#8217;s their problem, not yours.</p>
<p>And best of luck (or &#8220;broken legs&#8221; as appropriate) with the performance.</p>
]]></content:encoded>
	</item>
</channel>
</rss>

